If condemnation of apartheid and genocide is divisive, then maybe that’s a useful division to bring to the foreground. I don’t understand what it is that you see as the problem here. Can you explain?
You can and should condemn apartheid and genocide; but who is the “random German on Lemmy”? Are Germans bad? Is there a specific user you’re referring to, or are you casting a wide net and making “Germans” an outgroup? Maybe I don’t get it, but it looks like you’re condemning one thing at the expense of another… and that’s unnecessarily divisive to me if your only goal was to bring something into the foreground of conversation. Can you explain what your meme means?
My meme is an expression of my own experience that a bit too often when Israeli apartheid and genocide come up on lemmy, invariably some German user pops up and starts shifting the discourse to victim blaming the Palestinians. That’s not “all Germans bad”, just like when we criticize American users for making every single topic be about Democrats and Republicans, we are not saying “all Americans bad”. I complain about a tendency, not condemning an ethnic group.
I see what you’re saying, I guess it comes off as “all Germans” to me because “a random German” sounds like, “any random sample of Germans is likely to contain a xenophobic/nationalist individual”; when I feel like that could be the case for almost any random group… thus, unnecessarily creating an outgroup
Maybe instead of “random German person on Lemmy”, it could be “random xenophobic German person on Lemmy”…a little wordy, but it captures the irony of your statement, while also bringing the atrocities of Isreal to the forefront of attention
Idk, maybe I’m too much of a/an (insert label) and I’m killing the joke by overthinking
Edit: maybe it’s like mentioning “school shootings and guns” or “pittbulls” and inevitably awakening the indignant who just “have to comment and prove their point”… thus proving (and reinforcing) your own point. To me, it feels like introducing discussion on an already lopsided court; though I still respect your self-expression. I just feel it could be a little more nuanced so as to avoid any extra division… but that’s just my own two cents
I think it’s because everyone expects Germans to know better. And it’s pretty sad when it looks like the lesson that was learnt wasn’t “subjugation and genocide of a targeted demographic is bad” but instead “criticism of Israel is bad”.
People expect it from magas and religious nutters but not from Germans in 2025.
I appreciate the explanation. It still seems unnecessarily divisive though. If one had no context at all, this meme would just come off as “all Germans bad” or “all Germans are (insert one’s perception)”. Internalization of reactionary media isn’t rational, and this just seems to throw fuel on a fire that doesn’t even exist
People are just people at the end of the day, and some are less informed or more hateful than others, wherever you go. No need to create an outgroup in order to condemn something inherently evil
I’m sorry but pro-Palestinian demonstration is literally illegal in Germany now. This is not a small minority that OP is referring to. Polls show the vast majority of Germans support Israel no matter what they do. That’s not a nasty stereotype but deeply embedded in German culture
See, there it is again. “It’s a German thing. It’s not a stereotype, all Germans are”. You have to see the irony in what your statement boils down to. Anecdotes are funny little things that can really cause harm when internalized at face value
It’s not anecdote. There is a qualitative difference between how Germany and other European countries view Israel. If you can’t see that or don’t want to talk about it, we have nothing to discuss
Seems unnecessarily divisive. You could apply this template to practically any group of groups. But, ya know… go team!
Which teams? The critisism of genocide team and the… progenocide team?
If condemnation of apartheid and genocide is divisive, then maybe that’s a useful division to bring to the foreground. I don’t understand what it is that you see as the problem here. Can you explain?
You can and should condemn apartheid and genocide; but who is the “random German on Lemmy”? Are Germans bad? Is there a specific user you’re referring to, or are you casting a wide net and making “Germans” an outgroup? Maybe I don’t get it, but it looks like you’re condemning one thing at the expense of another… and that’s unnecessarily divisive to me if your only goal was to bring something into the foreground of conversation. Can you explain what your meme means?
Germany is very pro-Israel even with the ongoing genocide. What don’t you understand?
My meme is an expression of my own experience that a bit too often when Israeli apartheid and genocide come up on lemmy, invariably some German user pops up and starts shifting the discourse to victim blaming the Palestinians. That’s not “all Germans bad”, just like when we criticize American users for making every single topic be about Democrats and Republicans, we are not saying “all Americans bad”. I complain about a tendency, not condemning an ethnic group.
I see what you’re saying, I guess it comes off as “all Germans” to me because “a random German” sounds like, “any random sample of Germans is likely to contain a xenophobic/nationalist individual”; when I feel like that could be the case for almost any random group… thus, unnecessarily creating an outgroup
Maybe instead of “random German person on Lemmy”, it could be “random xenophobic German person on Lemmy”…a little wordy, but it captures the irony of your statement, while also bringing the atrocities of Isreal to the forefront of attention
Idk, maybe I’m too much of a/an (insert label) and I’m killing the joke by overthinking
Edit: maybe it’s like mentioning “school shootings and guns” or “pittbulls” and inevitably awakening the indignant who just “have to comment and prove their point”… thus proving (and reinforcing) your own point. To me, it feels like introducing discussion on an already lopsided court; though I still respect your self-expression. I just feel it could be a little more nuanced so as to avoid any extra division… but that’s just my own two cents
I hear you! Wish I had been more careful with the phrasing
I think it’s because everyone expects Germans to know better. And it’s pretty sad when it looks like the lesson that was learnt wasn’t “subjugation and genocide of a targeted demographic is bad” but instead “criticism of Israel is bad”.
People expect it from magas and religious nutters but not from Germans in 2025.
I appreciate the explanation. It still seems unnecessarily divisive though. If one had no context at all, this meme would just come off as “all Germans bad” or “all Germans are (insert one’s perception)”. Internalization of reactionary media isn’t rational, and this just seems to throw fuel on a fire that doesn’t even exist
People are just people at the end of the day, and some are less informed or more hateful than others, wherever you go. No need to create an outgroup in order to condemn something inherently evil
I’m sorry but pro-Palestinian demonstration is literally illegal in Germany now. This is not a small minority that OP is referring to. Polls show the vast majority of Germans support Israel no matter what they do. That’s not a nasty stereotype but deeply embedded in German culture
See, there it is again. “It’s a German thing. It’s not a stereotype, all Germans are”. You have to see the irony in what your statement boils down to. Anecdotes are funny little things that can really cause harm when internalized at face value
It’s not anecdote. There is a qualitative difference between how Germany and other European countries view Israel. If you can’t see that or don’t want to talk about it, we have nothing to discuss