efforts to extend Xorg’s life or replace it with similar alternatives continue.

This is 100% true, but the efforts are negligible and not even worth consideration.

• Xorg maintainers are doing just that: maintaining it (and, for the most part, begrudgingly). It will continue to exist for a long time, but that’s the only remarkable thing about it.
• XLibre is made by some anti-vaxx conspiracy dipshit who thinks ^ is an exponentiation operator in C and who got kicked off Xorg for being a moron who did functionally nothing of any importance while carelessly breaking things like the ABI. Enormous quantity but zero quality to speak of. It will go nowhere and only has any crumb of relevance because of the maintainer’s virtue signaling.
• Phoenix basically just started, yet Linux outlets are tripping over themselves to report on it, showing there’s very little real work to speak of in this space. It’s a nothingburger of a story. It doesn’t even do basically the only thing X11 is even good for anymore, which is support legacy applications.

As GNOME and KDE drop X11 and DEs like Cinnamon adopt Wayland, more and more actively maintained applications will stop giving a shit about X11. Even if they don’t explicitly not support it, none of the developers will be using it, and most of the userbase won’t either; thus, applications’ support for X11 will just rot away if it isn’t outright deprecated. Obviously X11 will always have a base of legacy applications, but you’re going to be seriously hard-pressed even two years from now to find someone who would use X11 over Wayland – except for specific and severely outdated hardware, conspiracy nutjobs, and the rare case where XWayland doesn’t properly support a legacy application.

Also on Nebula: https://nebula.tv/videos/techaltar-the-billion-dollar-race-to-replace-windows/

One of the best side effects of having gone vegan is that the cost of food has gone through the floor. Plant-based staples are dirt cheap and extremely shelf-stable, and because most times it’s easier and more interesting to cook for myself, I learned a lot of insanely cheap, yummy, and healthy foods to cook. I just bought 8 lb of Desi chickpeas and 20 lbs of basmati rice – enough to feed the fucking Artesh for a year – for about $30 (and I wasn’t trying to penny-pinch). The spices, herbs, sauces, oil, nuts, etc. that go into making that, meanwhile, barely even factor in cost-wise.

Even with a non-plant-based diet, you’ll find cooking staples like chicken at home saves you a fuckload of money.

And give George Washington a necrotic face. It’s symbolism, bro, not AI slop, I swear.

I mean use of the CLI on Linux generally. I used “terminal” vaguely because the original comment used it vaguely. “Down pat” is to say that I’m perfectly comfortable with it, namely that the course taught me:

• How to execute programs from the shell (and interrupt execution/kill processes).
• How to navigate and alter the filesystem, search for files and their contents, etc.
• How to install, remove, and configure software.
• How to set aliases.
• How to write shell scripts.
• How to edit files (although 99% of the time this is useless; I’ll just use something like Kate instead).
• How to parse and interpret program output.
• How to read man pages.
• Generally how to do anything I couldn’t/wouldn’t prefer to do from a GUI instead.

I use the shell vastly more than 99.99% of people and haven’t had a problem with or changed how I interact with it since that course; that to me is “down pat” for the terminal itself. I don’t care if I don’t know every application and flag ever made, because that’s not the point – like knowing how to use a GUI doesn’t mean you’ve memorized all GUI software, just that you know how to interpret the design language of and successfully use new GUI software. If I need to do something my current tools can’t, I can just search for the right program and use the man page to quickly write a command.

Meanwhile, with something like LibreOffice Calc, which I understand is much less feature-rich than the industry standard Excel, I don’t just learn about new functions like CORREL(), akin to what I said before about learning new CLI applications; I fundamentally learn how to create and edit spreadsheets more quickly. In Impress, I still learn how to make presentations more appealing, more readable, etc. Basically things that aren’t just rote memorization of gadgets that I could look up at any time. That’s what sets it apart to me – the fact that anything I don’t already know about the Linux terminal is present in readily available reference material and better off not memorized.

Well yeah, because I did. What else is there? I knew how to do everything I would ever need to do in the Linux command line. Anything I need to do beyond fundamental interactions, what else do I need to know besides how to 1) find a relevant CLI application and 2) read the man page to write a command? I even knew how to write basic shell scripts, which I would argue goes beyond “using the command line” and strays into “using a scripting language”. After that course, I never struggled with the Linux CLI because it taught me how to reason about it; is there a problem with that statement?

Is the timeframe and the setting the problem? Because I’m talking about going from never having used Linux or a CLI to being fluent with both, and the class was still a blowoff.

I know you already pointed out your sample is heavily biased, but to reiterate: macOS users you know predominantly from computer science and adjacent engineering fields are a very skewed sample. You can say that sprinkling terminal usage into a middle school computer literacy class is worthwhile, and I might even agree. But to treat it as anything more than something used by enthusiasts, programmers, IT professionals, scientists (on a very basic level that can be learned in 10 minutes), teenagers trying to look badass, and the one-in-a-million frustrated “normie” user who falls into it through some troubleshooting/game modding/etc. tutorial simply isn’t realistic.

Regarding ping: what good is it going to do a normal user who doesn’t understand basic networking? It can rarely tell me basic useful information, like that my DNS is fucked up (can’t get to websites but can ping). For normal users it’ll just tell them the Internet isn’t working, which they probably already figured out, but how do they resolve it? Pictured: a normal user who can use ping figuring out their Internet isn’t working. To make something like ping meaningfully useful, you need to teach them basic Layer 3 concepts too, which is fine, but that’s not a terminal skill – that’s networking skills with a trivial terminal command stapled on.

Anyone can learn to use an office suite on their own in very little time

Okay, should I say the same about a terminal then? I took a single-semester Linux course and had the terminal down pat. Meanwhile, I grew up learning how to use an office suite day in and day out in K–12 and still find new ways to improve my workflow in one.

so there’s no reason to teach it

Besides the fact that it’s a cornerstore of modern society that any white-collar professional will routinely have to work with, sure. (If you want to pull the “we shouldn’t be turning our kids into workers” card for why teaching them basic job skills is bad, things like word processing and spreadsheets are/can be very useful outside of industry too.)

Being able to use the command line is a valuable skill that makes you a way better computer user no matter what you’re doing

Okay, like… kind of? It gives you a better mindset, but in terms of a specific application, unless you’re in a niche part of industry or have niche interests, you will never in your life need to touch the terminal at this point. You will be just fine. Even as a power user, there are few problems normal users would face where I look at the terminal and see a shortcut to something that would be tedious in the GUI – and fuck knows most people use their desktop OS less than I do if they even have one anymore.

and it’s one that a lot of people are missing these days.

Because as noted, no major OS except desktop Linux makes you interact with the terminal in any meaningful way – and even desktop Linux is changing that because designers understand that, while the terminal is a godsend for power users, everyday users have no compelling reason to deal with it.

I don’t think you can really say you know how to use a computer if you can only use it in the very specific ways someone happens to have made a gui for

This is elitist bullshit that isn’t reflected in the real world. It’s not 1992 anymore. If people can efficiently complete the workflows they need via a GUI and never touch the terminal, then good for them; they know how to use a computer. This comment is so profoundly out-of-touch with how most actual humans live their lives that I feel like I’ve tripped and fallen into another reality.

Okay, but, like… No? How delusional do you have to be to think something you never have to touch in Windows, macOS, iOS, or Android (and probably less and less going forward in desktop Linux, an already extremely niche OS) is more important than learning how to use a word processor, make presentations, or work with spreadsheets? (Microsoft Office specifically is used because it’s the industry standard as part of a vicious cycle, but not the school’s fault or problem). Do you, like, exist in the real world outside a very specific industry/set of interests?

The y-axis matters, OP. This still means Lemmy has 20x as many monthly active users as PieFed. Both of which are quite small in the grand scheme of things.

Wine/11

For what it’s worth, DEs like KDE have their own GUI resource monitor preinstalled. CLI programs like btop are just there if you want to use them. See, for example, KDE’s.

Do yourself a favor, gurl: https://www.privacyguides.org/en/passwords/

True. Just an FYI, if you have a reasonable editing track record, you can get an exemption from that block.

You’re not contradicting anything they said, and you’re not contradicting that Steam is a monopoly.

That tends to happen when you have a monopoly on an industry where you get 30% of the revenue from other people’s hard work.

So vindicated.

Stop spamming LLM slop, OP.

Look at how they’re a one-day-old account spamming the everloving fuck out of Lemmy and using obvious LLM-isms. If not an autonomous bot, then absolutely LLM slop being posted by a human.

For a solid 10 seconds, I was transported to a reality where Mozilla shunted development of Rust off to some random studio who were removing Linux support because it wasn’t in the budget.