Wait so if the Lemmy devs are transphobic… Should there not be a fork at this rate? Also, I’ve heard a lot of shit talked about .ml and seemingly for good reason but what’s the story with all this? How did it get this bad?
Piefed has a list of words they deem naughty built into the system. Fuck that bullshit. I’m an adult, I don’t need some random nanny deciding what is and is not acceptable language for me.
I’m aware. But if people are going to criticize the Lemmy devs for their ideology which they don’t inject into the architecture of their software it seems fair to point out the ideology of the Piefed devs that they do inject into theirs, even if said ideology is less egregious. I don’t agree with the Lemmy devs on a lot of things, but I respect their ability to develop without such injections.
Still an overreach, imo. Who are they to deem which communities are worthy, especially based on the “appropriateness” of the community name? It’s entirely unnecessary, and Piefed would be better off without it.
Having looked at the words and code specifically in reference here, I think it’s a copy and paste job from another local function (the local piefed.social retention rules)
If it’s some kind of carryover oversight, that does definitely change the perspective. That said, as it exists today my criticism of nannying remains valid, so now that it’s known if it is simple oversight then the devs should absolutely now remove it to the fix the issue.
So wait, is this another hub for Lemmy’s servers? How is this different then just accessing Lemmy through a third party app? Is this a totally different platform despite accessing the same servers? I’m a bit confused.
Not really - while it is part of the Fediverse, it is not Lemmy. In that sense it’s closer to mastodon or pixelfed than a different client, with the key difference being that since the structure/interface are so similar, they’re much more easily integrated with each other, so most likely have already interacted with a lost or comment from a Piefed user on a Lemmy community without even noticing :)
Different Lemmy clients still connect you to the same servers and accounts, while Piefed’s are completely separate - although several Lemmy servers are running their own instance of Piefed too, on a different domain. So, you “access the same servers” in the sense of posts, comments, votes, and potentially server hardware, but not for your account and server software
The good thing is, this is a federated service, and many instances are defederated from them if you want that. Also, they haven’t added anything to the code that’s bad, and it can be forked if they do.
Meanwhile, piefed, while it seems nice, has issues too. The language they’re using, while it is easy, so allows for easier contribution, isn’t as fast/powerful. They also hardcoded a block list for things like meme communities, and IIRC “NoMoreMuskSpam”, and things like that. This can be removed by admins, but by default they’re blocked. It’s pretty stupid.
No clue. It’s a pretty crazy thing to do. An minimum, it should have been in a separate file that’s made to be modified, but that’s not what it is for some reason.
Basically the ml owners are the lemmy mods who also own the grad instance.
They are terrible people and it got this far because lemmy was the alternative to reddit that wasn’t filled with racism, transphobes and incels, so people with good intentions stuck and cheered for lemmy to develop while they hosted their own instances with their own rules so at least they didn’t have to tolerate the lemmy devs, hexbear and their trolls too much.
By this point there is kbin (or mbin? i keep forgetting) and piefed, there’s no need to support lemmy in anyway anymore, hence why there are more and more instances defederating from ml altough some still federate with them like dbzer0 (but they also federate with hexbear).
The next step should be hosts migrating to piefed or kbin and app devs dropping lemmy support, the first one is already happening in some instances, the later one not yet.
I see… Yikes. I know nothing about those other projects and I’ll look them up, but are they forks of Lemmy handled by different people, or just front ends TO Lemmy? Apologies if I’m missing something obvious.
I think what you got mixed up is the software side and moderation. You can use the same software as .ml and have nothing to do with it. It’s called instance and there are many. This isn’t just front end. There are different front ends (apps, web, …) as well but that’s a different story.
You are on pawb.social as you most certainly already know. That’s hosted and handled by different people than .ml. It’s just the same software and the software isn’t the problem
And since the software is free, no one profits from it. As an instance, it can choose to federate with .ml and even if (as my instance does, don’t know about yours), there is no guilt by association in my opinion. Being federated means you can see their content and they see yours but yours is moderated by your mods alone.
So they technically aren’t forks since the software is the same but they are still handled by different people because they are exact copies software side. I hope that makes it clearer.
It’s just the same software and the software isn’t the problem
I disagree, the devs and ml/grad hosts can decide which things to improve, mantain or force into the other instances, I think there were plans to hardcode the ml federation into it (saw it in a post that was removed for a different reason so I hope someone else kept the screenshot) because too many instances were defederating from them.
There’s also the devs keeping the blocking function half-assed so nobody can fully block ml/grad content.
They claim donations for the Lemmy software are not used to help their hosting of ml or grad, but they have proven to lie and be malicious, so there’s no reason to believe them.
Also using their software is helping them stay sort of relevant to the fediverse and nobody wants assholes to be relevant.
At any rate, there are already better alternatives that aren’t linked to propagandists, transphobes and history revitionists, so why not use something better?
Wait so if the Lemmy devs are transphobic… Should there not be a fork at this rate? Also, I’ve heard a lot of shit talked about .ml and seemingly for good reason but what’s the story with all this? How did it get this bad?
Forks for ideological reasons will almost always fail if the issue isn’t with the code.
The lemmy devs bad opinions have not made it into lemmy itself.
https://piefed.social/
Piefed has a list of words they deem naughty built into the system. Fuck that bullshit. I’m an adult, I don’t need some random nanny deciding what is and is not acceptable language for me.
Which word in particular are you inconvenienced by not being able to use?
It can be and is disabled by other instances.
I’m aware. But if people are going to criticize the Lemmy devs for their ideology which they don’t inject into the architecture of their software it seems fair to point out the ideology of the Piefed devs that they do inject into theirs, even if said ideology is less egregious. I don’t agree with the Lemmy devs on a lot of things, but I respect their ability to develop without such injections.
Also, the context here is automatic federation of communities - right? It’s not a keyword filter in the sense that you’re referring to.
Still an overreach, imo. Who are they to deem which communities are worthy, especially based on the “appropriateness” of the community name? It’s entirely unnecessary, and Piefed would be better off without it.
Having looked at the words and code specifically in reference here, I think it’s a copy and paste job from another local function (the local piefed.social retention rules)
If it’s some kind of carryover oversight, that does definitely change the perspective. That said, as it exists today my criticism of nannying remains valid, so now that it’s known if it is simple oversight then the devs should absolutely now remove it to the fix the issue.
So wait, is this another hub for Lemmy’s servers? How is this different then just accessing Lemmy through a third party app? Is this a totally different platform despite accessing the same servers? I’m a bit confused.
Not really - while it is part of the Fediverse, it is not Lemmy. In that sense it’s closer to mastodon or pixelfed than a different client, with the key difference being that since the structure/interface are so similar, they’re much more easily integrated with each other, so most likely have already interacted with a lost or comment from a Piefed user on a Lemmy community without even noticing :) Different Lemmy clients still connect you to the same servers and accounts, while Piefed’s are completely separate - although several Lemmy servers are running their own instance of Piefed too, on a different domain. So, you “access the same servers” in the sense of posts, comments, votes, and potentially server hardware, but not for your account and server software
I see, thank you!!
The good thing is, this is a federated service, and many instances are defederated from them if you want that. Also, they haven’t added anything to the code that’s bad, and it can be forked if they do.
Meanwhile, piefed, while it seems nice, has issues too. The language they’re using, while it is easy, so allows for easier contribution, isn’t as fast/powerful. They also hardcoded a block list for things like meme communities, and IIRC “NoMoreMuskSpam”, and things like that. This can be removed by admins, but by default they’re blocked. It’s pretty stupid.
What the fuck?? Why??
No clue. It’s a pretty crazy thing to do. An minimum, it should have been in a separate file that’s made to be modified, but that’s not what it is for some reason.
Basically the ml owners are the lemmy mods who also own the grad instance.
They are terrible people and it got this far because lemmy was the alternative to reddit that wasn’t filled with racism, transphobes and incels, so people with good intentions stuck and cheered for lemmy to develop while they hosted their own instances with their own rules so at least they didn’t have to tolerate the lemmy devs, hexbear and their trolls too much.
By this point there is kbin (or mbin? i keep forgetting) and piefed, there’s no need to support lemmy in anyway anymore, hence why there are more and more instances defederating from ml altough some still federate with them like dbzer0 (but they also federate with hexbear).
The next step should be hosts migrating to piefed or kbin and app devs dropping lemmy support, the first one is already happening in some instances, the later one not yet.
I see… Yikes. I know nothing about those other projects and I’ll look them up, but are they forks of Lemmy handled by different people, or just front ends TO Lemmy? Apologies if I’m missing something obvious.
I think what you got mixed up is the software side and moderation. You can use the same software as .ml and have nothing to do with it. It’s called instance and there are many. This isn’t just front end. There are different front ends (apps, web, …) as well but that’s a different story.
You are on pawb.social as you most certainly already know. That’s hosted and handled by different people than .ml. It’s just the same software and the software isn’t the problem And since the software is free, no one profits from it. As an instance, it can choose to federate with .ml and even if (as my instance does, don’t know about yours), there is no guilt by association in my opinion. Being federated means you can see their content and they see yours but yours is moderated by your mods alone.
So they technically aren’t forks since the software is the same but they are still handled by different people because they are exact copies software side. I hope that makes it clearer.
I disagree, the devs and ml/grad hosts can decide which things to improve, mantain or force into the other instances, I think there were plans to hardcode the ml federation into it (saw it in a post that was removed for a different reason so I hope someone else kept the screenshot) because too many instances were defederating from them.
There’s also the devs keeping the blocking function half-assed so nobody can fully block ml/grad content.
They claim donations for the Lemmy software are not used to help their hosting of ml or grad, but they have proven to lie and be malicious, so there’s no reason to believe them.
Also using their software is helping them stay sort of relevant to the fediverse and nobody wants assholes to be relevant.
At any rate, there are already better alternatives that aren’t linked to propagandists, transphobes and history revitionists, so why not use something better?