So I recently discovered there’s an anarchist bookfair happening in Tartu, Estonia. So I made these icons as a way to contribute spreading the news. What do you think?
More info about the bookfair is here: https://riga-anarchist-bookfair.hotglue.me/
So I recently discovered there’s an anarchist bookfair happening in Tartu, Estonia. So I made these icons as a way to contribute spreading the news. What do you think?
More info about the bookfair is here: https://riga-anarchist-bookfair.hotglue.me/
National flags and anarchism?
The flags are more meant to signify culture than nations/states. For me the flags have a cultural relation that’s far more powerful than the states. The flags were used by the people as a signifier of culture before the states took them and turned them into their own symbolica. Even in anarchism culture will persist and having symbols for these cultures is important.
Or to put it simply: “The state stole the flag from the people and now we will steal it back by using it to fight against it”.
national flags are exactly what they are. Keep them away from any anarchist symbol.
would you make another one with the American flag? You’re trying to sugarcoat a strange idea.
No I wouldn’t make one with the USA flag, because USA isn’t a culture. It’s a state. A State baked in colonialism and slavery. The USA flag didn’t exist before the state needed one. The design of the flag itself is based on the political reality. If I were to design anarchist iconography for north america I would use the first peoples’ flags as a template, or mangle the stars and stripes so much that it becomes unrecognisable.
The baltic flags aren’t like that. (Or at least the estonian one can’t really speak for the other two.) They are also symbols for the people. Used to identify a culture even when the state didn’t exist. A flag that’s designed by a bunch of university students that then became used by a country that was just finding it’s identity emerging from an oppressive overlord. At it’s heart these flags were used as symbols of resistance and identity to fight against a foreign regime. Why not take it one step further and use these symbols to fight against the idea of statehood itself? As a message that we decide what our symbols are and if we want to we can take yours.
The biggest difference is that these flags don’t just represent a colony. They represent a unique set of people that have their own language. The fundamental element of culture and until we create visual indicators for these languages that are separate from the states the flags are the best we have.
And as you ended you’re comment with a tangential question here’s mine: What do I use instead? What visual shorthand can I use to denote that this concerns the baltic region? That there are people who speak Estonian, Latvian, Lithuanian here?
Thanks for taking your time to explain, you convinced me :). Sorry for sparkling this debate, I should’ve considered that there’s a lot of hate for Baltic people in anglo leftist circles. I’d personally try to put some other cultural symbols maybe? But I’m Polish and in Poland the flag is mostly associated with nationalism (though not as obviously as the union jack or US flag). We’ve even opressed you guys under that flag :x.
Your designs are really neat, I like the circular one most.
read a little about nationalism and how it redefined the world.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Estonia according to that page, apparently this flag was born as a response to a similar question 200 years ago.
Why, for an anarchist, is it important to emphasize a national identity?
To me it’s not emphasising national identity. It’s signifying a culture. A culture that has been heavily oppressed and is currently starting to slowly languish as the bigger and more predominant culture slowly smothers it. I’ve seen this happen in my own mind as my internal monologue switched languages after watching a lot of english TV and Youtube.
It’s a shame that a language that is very different in it’s construction is starting to slowly be drowned out just because the internet has made english the language everyone speaks. I have no love for the state or the national identity the flag represents. That’s why I put a circled A on/next to it. To signify that I reject the state and the nationalism while accepting the culture behind that state.
The problem with nationalism, why it is nationalism, is the idea that only a certain group of people are deserving or valid in a culture. That speaking a different language or having different parents made you somehow different or superior or more deserving. It’s a method of othering. This is the core idea behind nationalism and it’s the one I (and every anarchist) reject. Everyone who wants to, is an estonian, no matter where they come from, it’s a culture, not a nationality¹. There is nothing inferior about being part of a different culture, but that different culture does exist and it needs to have a name and symbolica to survive.
¹: Do I need to say “for me” or “in my opinion”. I’ve gotten a lot of people treating me like an idiot because I leave it out from statements like these, but I just assume that’s implied. I’m saying it… and it’s blatantly false as a fact… of course it’s my opinion.
We have flags for every branch of anarchism for this reason. They all have slightly different ways of doing things. Slightly different cultures and customs. While I could try and come up with a flag design that works for this culture while not referencing the only other flag that the culture uses just because a state snatched it up first, using the already established visual shorthand for the culture is easier. And it’s also stealing one of the primary symbols the state uses to legitimise itself, the idea that it speaks for the entire culture. It does not. There are also anarchists who are part of this culture, and reject your nation.
And in the end. I don’t even care that much about this (yes this is how much effort I but into things I have minor care for). If everyone on this com said that this is a stupid idea I’d probably change my mind, but as it stands you’re the only one who has said anything about this. I wouldn’t use the flag in any other situation. I like the standard Circled A on black background for most things, but in situations where I need to reference the region of land between the Baltic sea and Peipsi I will use the blue-black-white flag with A Circled A on top and call it estonia, it’s the easiest solution.
i wasn’t the only critic of your idea
maybe you should read instead of “watching TV and Youtube”
Nationalism “further aims to build, and maintain, a single national identity, based on a combination of shared social characteristics such as culture, ethnicity, homeland, language, politics (or government), religion, traditions, or belief in a shared singular history, and to promote national unity or solidarity.”
France for example is a multicultural nation. One can “be French” without belonging to a certain culture. There are some shared values but nation, being an artifice, is redefined constantly. Still, you won’t be seeing anarchists with tricolor flags there. They may carry the black flag (or the red/black) but it would be absurd to draw circled A on a national flag.
Maybe you’re not an anarchist after all. Maybe being Estonian will overpower your libertarian flame in time.
maybe you will end up being a flag merchant 🤷
Fuck it. I’m done with you. You don’t seem to listen.
Actually, No. Here is the AFAQ chapter on nationalism: https://anarchistfaq.org/afaq/sectionD.html#secd6, and it is the perfect example of what I’m talking about.
My use of the flags is to showcase the nationalities that partake in this event, as they are in the geographic area. Not the nationalism of the state which has usurped these symbols.
And trust me I am an anarchist. First and foremost. Anarchism is the surrounding idea of the centre of my being, which is one word: “Kind”. I doubt there is anything that can overpower it. It’s fuelled by the kind of faith that others reserve only for god.
you can be kind and nationalist too, like in reverse you can be an anarchist who is not kind at all. Has nothing to do with it.
can you, like i mentioned before, literally sugarcoat those flags during the event. At least it would be fun.
oh! You can even make those flags from sugar and eat them. 1st international anarchist flag eating competition… yay!
Hi! I’m here from all, so not very familiar with anarchist discourse. But as this affects me, being from the baltics, I have to ask: is fighting against (relatively) democratic states reasonable at this time? As long as russia, USA and china exist in their current form, there is no hope for a stateless society to exist without being crushed under the boots of a larger country.
The Palestine protesters in England who destroyed military production infrastructure are ideologically correct, but in the short term their work has a direct positive effect on ruzzia’s oppressive behaviour.
What’s your take on this? Love the imagery btw.
Many anarchists would disagree with this. Anarchists strive to establish communities/stateless societies that are able to defend themselves against state repression. Many anarchists also believe state organized militaries to not be as effective in actually defending territory against invaders.
While not all examples are anarchist and successful, they all share libertarian ideals and are examples of libertarian communities defending territory against states / authoritarian forces. I think they should provide enough information to imagine an anarchist society defending itself:
Vexillology is information theory, not nationalism