Despite how a lady at the bookstore “struggled with” my pronouns and bounced off “he” several times before settling on “they” cause apparently she couldn’t bring herself to say “she.”
Shit’s hard out there.
Despite how a lady at the bookstore “struggled with” my pronouns and bounced off “he” several times before settling on “they” cause apparently she couldn’t bring herself to say “she.”
Shit’s hard out there.
Yes, in the absence of awareness of your situation, I make various assumptions or guesses about the situation. I had considered that your partner never asked you to not transition, but what happens I think is that all the other conversations I’ve had with people whose situation seemed similar to yours get conflated or generalized, and so I respond as though you are one of the many others.
This is of course a gloss, and that is unfair to you since it makes assumptions that aren’t true and aren’t relevant.
At some point I think I was aware of the irrelevance of my words to you and your situation - or at least aware of the likelihood of that.
I think this is part of why I said things like if I put myself in the shoes of your partner and imagined even if not asking just knowing I was a reason for someone not transitioning - it’s not that I absolutely ignored that possibility, I just didn’t know whether it was the most likely possibility.
So yes, assumptions were made - but part of that is because I don’t wish to pry or confront, to engage directly on your circumstances is not my goal, instead I just react to what you have disclosed so that I’m being transparent about my own hang-ups, faults, reactions, and so on - partially because I think I want this feedback from you about how to be better, and for that you need to see how I’m thinking in the first place.
You are absolutely right that I made bad assumptions, and I’m sorry for that. The assumption that your partner asked you not to transition was never so “solid” or sure on my end, but I can see how it comes across that I’m thinking it anyway.
I also think there was some conflation of medical vs social transition, but this was again just a generalization or a gloss, handling each separately didn’t occur to me as much in that situation, and maybe generally, for various reasons. To be honest, I think even if we split the two and talk about “social transition” and “medical transition”, we are still glossing and generalizing. To be honest a lot of this is just about the economy of language and thought, I am happy to be super narrow in my concepts but I think it can be tedious to read, and overly verbose - two things I already skew towards in my writing. Not every trans person has the same “medical transition”, for example, so often when I’m talking about “transition” in this context, I’m really talking about the (offensively assumed) “missing component” of HRT, even though the term otherwise implies much more (even HRT itself can designate different things, and depending on the route of administration and the dose, HRT can have dramatically different results for people and mean different things for people).
So, to continue in my thought-transparency (sorry, maybe this is not useful to you), I socially transitioned before I medically transitioned, and my own experiences certainly skew the way I think - particularly what I experienced was that social transition made my life worse in many ways and maybe wasn’t the best choice, while HRT was life-saving. Truly, HRT was the most clinically relevant component of the whole transition experience as far as I can tell. Social transition for me was just a way to force myself out of the closet and prevent further refusal to transition.
So this is pretty much my perspective too, in conflating social and medical transition I think the challenges of social transition were generalized and put together with medical transition… So of course I agree with you on everything. Surgeries can be quite painful and difficult to get through, but at the very least I think HRT is quite wonderful, and makes life easier and better. That’s the fundamental point I’m trying to get across here: it’s so great, you and every other trans person should at least try it to verify whether it’s also a life-saving medication or not. And again, that mindset is built on the empirical evidence we have that not doing it results in worse health outcomes and deaths while doing it alleviates those risks.
Oh, I didn’t feel pity at all, lol - sorry, maybe that would have made sense, but you just don’t know me and it makes sense you wouldn’t understand. I think what I’m feeling is maybe a connection to my pre-transition self and all the sacrifices they made, basically I haven’t really accepted being trans and I’m still occupying a mindset of believing what I’ve done is selfish and wrong, and so I basically glorify your choice to sacrifice for your partner by not medically transitioning (note here I’m making more assumptions, I have no idea if you have taken medical transition steps, maybe you just haven’t had surgeries but you’ve been on HRT and this whole conversation is just me making really dumb assumptions). I don’t feel sorry for you, I feel envious - I spent a lot of my life being “good” the way you are now, making that kind of huge sacrifice and carrying that burden. In all my self-loathing and guilt, I think I miss that - my fucked up psychology seems to feel it’s much better to be a martyr than to engage in self-care. The change in that perspective has not been complete.
I do think your choice is probably self-harming, but what you miss is that I think this is maybe a good thing still. I can’t help but still operate under that old logic, I am skeptical that taking care of myself this way is really justified. That said, I’m pretty sure that’s just my desire for punishment and suffering, and it’s probably not healthy or good - or even related to you, tbh. Sorry, I really am, I hope by being so transparent I’m helping somehow, but I worry it’s just indulgent and wasting your time.
So, I am confused, I thought this started by talking about how you use non-binary as a quick gloss of your gender, but that seemed to imply your actual identity isn’t non-binary, it’s just the result of this compromise you have made about transition … was I mistaken about that?
And yeah, a lot of personal baggage comes up with the trans stuff - I am projecting like crazy, making bad assumptions, etc. but I think the fundamental message still holds. Maybe an awkward analogy would
make this interaction so much worsehelp explain my perspective: imagine someone had cancer throughout their breasts, but the cancer had become dormant. Let’s say there is empirical evidence that this situation could result in increased risk of dying early, maybe the body isn’t as healthy with the cancer in it, maybe the cancer could come back at some point - the analogy here is the way that the “wrong” hormones in the body cause depression, anxiety, suicidal ideation, etc. - it’s biochemical, the brain is altered by it. Let’s say the dormant cancer messes with the body and mind too, and so you won’t have the same energy, happiness, or general well-being unless the breasts and cancer are removed. It’s a stretch, but we can imagine it, right? So, what I hear a lot of people saying (not just you, mind you - this is part of what’s going on here, I’m interacting with lots of people in marriages who refuse to transition, socially and / or medically), is that their partner really likes their breasts, they are attracted to and attached to their breasts, and if they have their breasts removed it will be devastating to the relationship. Their partner won’t be attracted to them anymore and it will spell the end of the relationship. They can’t help that their partner is sexually attracted to their breasts, and so they have to choose between keeping the dormant cancer-ridden breasts and the risks and health consequences that come with it, or they can have the surgery and risk losing their relationship.I just don’t find keeping the cancerous breasts a reasonable option, ever. I think the trans issue is actually worse than the cancer, because it has to do with identity and who you are - living as someone else for a relationship is worse than just leaving dormant cancer in the body.
My view is that the only reason we think it’s reasonable to keep the cancer is because we have been acculturated to believe it’s wrong to transition, that it’s a betrayal of the spouse, and that it’s not that helpful medically. But that’s just not what the empirical evidence shows.
I think this might be my struggle with black & white thinking, there are a few things going on with me. I might also feel like I had to justify my transition and that requires an extreme position, otherwise I have to admit I could have been like the Mennonite and gone the rest of my life without transitioning and I should have just toughed it out.
Anyway, my point is that I’m not trying to apply this to you as much as I’m trying to show my hang-up, I guess I’m hoping for you to complicate my view, to show me why I’m wrong. Maybe you can’t do that, maybe it’s wrong for me to expect or ask. Either way, that’s how I think about this, and nothing you’ve said makes it make sense.
Of course, on the other hand I completely understand your perspective, that a partner is like your life blood, more important than even your own self. I would do the same.
Now extrapolating from our conversation I will make a few leaps. It seems to be that in many ways medical transition for you was revelatory. It makes sense you want to evangelize it. I imagine though it is also something that you’ve had to self advocate a lot for to pursue - which can be traumatic. Defending your choices to friends, family members and medical professionals to the bar demanded is stressful and there is strain that can impact you long term.
However that fight can twist you out of true. When you see someone who isn’t conforming to that model that you had to advocate so hard for maybe it’s a little threatening? Maybe to you it has to be unhealthy to do what I am doing because that strain of self advocacy has boxed you into a position where everything you’ve done doesn’t seem valid if it wasn’t nessisary. So when I come along with a different situation where I am existing alright without the things you’ve had to defend as nessisary for your continued success it comes across as a challenge to that hypothesis. Hence why you keep probing for fault with my situation
Maybe you aren’t looking at my situation as simply a thing I am doing, you are looking at it as an arguement against the validity of what you are doing
Thing is - and I say this with emphasis - none of the choices I have personally made or the reasons behind them have anything to do with yours. My situation being stable and reasonably healthy doesn’t invalidate any of your choices. If you believe what you did is nessisary - it was. It doesn’t have to be universally nessisary.
Better yet : who said your transition needs to be necessary to be worthwhile? I certainly didn’t. If it was just what you wanted with all your heart - that’s enough. You should be able.
There’s also this valorizing of my endurance I am picking up on which I think may have been from my statement about how one handles different types of pain. I think you may have taken it as some type of “I’m a fucking bad ass and can endure” sort of sentiment…but that’s really not it. What was intended was this -enduring something is handled differently when you are adequately rewarded for your trouble. Yes my experience sucks but I have but when that happens I have adequate reasons to remind myself why exactly why I am doing this. Would I endure this if I were not nigh constantly rewarded for my efforts? No… It’s not bravery or self perceived strength that I should hold out because I can or some kind of deep seated transphobia. I don’t believe that sacrificing for love is some noble thing. It’s literally just the offsets have been simply judged worth the cost. The Mennonite woman is doing what she does out of an assertion that she is stronger and more moral than other people who have made different choices. That’s, pardon the language, self aggrandizing bull shit.
The reaction some have trying to convince me of what I am doing as being wrong in some way is something I encounter specifically with binary trans folk who have been through the ringer or who are insecure to the point where I am pretty sure what they are doing is a trauma response. However just because it’s a potential trauma response doesn’t mean it is cool. Think of it this way - In trying to stess test my transition choices by finding fault this way binary trans people are doing what cis people did to them just in reverse - The requesting or coercing of trans people to defend their transition choices. Enbies are sometimes looked at as the weak flank of the arguements that trans people make to society for the right to accommodation. These forms of Enbyphobia aren’t often discussed because it’s acknowledged that these issues come from pressure from outside the community. A united front pushing things as a nessesity is what gets traction with cis people. Edge cases, nuanced situations and people who do not neatly fit into that narrative sometimes become targets because we are inconvenient so we get hit on multiple flanks having to justify our choices to binary trans people and cis people. It’s that shared experience more than anything that keeps me solidly identifying as non-binary rather than binary trans. It’s also a personal declaration that I need not conform to anybody else’s views of masculinity and acknowledging/accepting rather than rejecting this space I occupy as a possible end goal.
Sorry for the delay, I want to come back to this and I am feeling myself becoming perfectionistic about my response (leading me to not respond at all), but in short I think you’re right. You have captured the essence of the problem, I think: I have had to justify my transition, and all that pressure has created a certain way of thinking about transition that then becomes normative and gets externalized or projected onto others.
There are only a few corrections I would make, e.g. I didn’t mean to imply the “I’m a fucking bad ass and can endure” mindset, but something adjacent to it, more that making sacrifices for the people in your life is a virtuous thing. It’s more about being pro-social than about being macho, if that makes sense. But I think that perspective of mine still misses the point you make, which is that it’s not the kind of moral sacrifice the Mennonite engages in, you are not doing it for your partner, but for yourself because you value your partner. This is just not the same.
This was really helpful framing, thank you for your insights. I still haven’t reconciled my internal cognitive dissonance (i.e. a part of me still thinks there is a way to justify transition as being normative), but either way it is clear to me that this is complicated and the attempt to “help” can create a lot of harm.
I think this is related a bit to the egg prime directive and the culture formed around not telling someone they are actually a trans person in denial. On the one hand if a person is trans and in denial there is a lot of potential harm from that denial and there is a sense of urgency to helping the person past that denial so they can avoid the harm. On the other hand, no one can make those decisions or force that awareness on the person who may or may not actually be trans, even when it seems clear.
Being forced to justify not transitioning is a kind of gender policing, even if a kind of policing in the opposite direction as the dominant ideology (which tells you not to be trans and not to transition).
While there might be a need for some way to help people overcome the social situation preventing them from realizing they are trans and keeping them from transitioning, it’s clear to me those methods shouldn’t be coercive, like the way you mention feeling stress-tested about your decisions around transition.
I have a lot to think through, but I am genuinely challenged by your perspective and this has been so extremely valuable to me - I cannot thank you enough.
I am glad to have been of help!
With the trans community being under so much pressure from outside it really has negative impacts inside the community crushing down the narratives into only the most defensible to cis people. We repeat them so often it’s likely we’ll internalize that framework and that’s not great for us I think. We defend things so often in terms of nessesity and harm prevention and medicalization of the trans experience that trans joy and the nature of creatures to chase the conditions they instinctually know are the most conducive to happiness get lost.
If the cis folk understood the first thing about being trans, really understood, they wouldn’t try and stop us from doing what we want. It’s only because they get the ick about body modifications that we are forced to be beggars and question ourselves if we are adequately poorly off enough for rescue by a system that really only cares about survival, not quality of life. We shouldn’t have to be dying to be worth care or the grace to be ourselves. We don’t have to follow any specific playbook or treatment plan. We are not sick. It’s hard to resist but don’t let them get in your head and make you start looking at yourself as a paitent and not a deserving seeker of comfort and joy. You don’t need to find joy perfect and whole to make it worthy of the risk or the cost.