I’m sorry but I’ll just say it out right: new feminists are the absolute worst
Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for equality where possible. Where isn’t equality possible? Well I’d like to conceive a child, but the plumbing isn’t exactly useful for that. That sort of thing. Beyond that, were all the same, and IDGAF about your skin color, sexual preferences or whatever. I live by live and Let live, don’t be an asshole, it’s not that hard to be respectful
New feminists though are the ones coming up with ideas like this website. On the surface, anyone could say that it’s not a bad thing to have a place for women to talk about how to protect themselves. In reality though, it’s a place where men, innocent or not, get doxxed and made to be rapists.
There are some subs here on Lemmy as well that were very sad to see this shitshow of a website go, lamenting the fact that now they need a different place to dex people. Try not to tell them that doxxing is bad, it gets you banned.
I think the key reason this was seen as not being terribly offensive was the fact that women are disproportionately more likely than men to be on the receiving end of tons of different negative consequences when dating, thus to a degree justifying them having more of a safe space where their comfort and safety is prioritized.
However I think a lot of people are also recognizing now that such an app has lots of downsides that come as a result of that kind of structure, like false allegations being given too much legitimacy, high amounts of sensitive data storage, negative interactions being blown out of proportion, etc. I also think that this is yet another signature case of “private market solution to systemic problem” that only kind of addresses the symptoms, but not the actual causes of these issues that are rooted more in our societal standards and expectations of the genders, upbringing, depictions in media, etc.
I’m always reminded of the fact that women on dating sites rate 80% of the men as below average….
And the dating advisors who have written numerous articles about how women don’t really know or aren’t really honest with themselves about what they are looking for in a partner….
I was making the point, that despite the fact that this is mildly ok. The test for anything that gives one group power over another, is to switch the groups.
If it’s still reasonable, than it is probably OK to keep it. If however it seems wrong after the switch, the bar to keep the power imbalance should be very high.
That’s a very superficial test that deliberately omits the social and historical context that makes sense of these categories. You can’t just insert one party for another in statements about a relationship where one side has more power and privilege than the other, and look at your feelings about the result to evaluate the statements. White people have historically mistreated everyone else and robbed them of freedom and power. Men have historically abused women. To say “let’s swap the words and see how we feel then” is not a reasonable way of evaluating statements about the relationships between these groups.
What this article says about the importance of entrenched power structures in racism also holds true about the relations between men and women:
Stats depend on perception. Where a woman reports abuse, a man often spends an evening drinking or something similar. Not reporting abuse.
Expectations of men are too somewhat cruel. You should be grenadier-tall (or gorilla-wide, point being, you should look fit), with facial features like those of Kianu Reeves, with voice like that of Orlando Bloom, confident like some CEO, honorable like a samurai from some movie, yet able to override that honor at her whim and do any atrocity to make the world better for her. Like some picture of 1930s’ propaganda.
If you don’t deliver, then she silently pities herself and silently looks down at you for that. But God forbid you seem like that picture in some regard and then inevitably turn out to be more human, that deceit she won’t forgive.
It was a problem a century ago that women were mostly right-wing and chauvinist and traditionalist. Most of that has been undone, but not how women in average see gender relations.
OK, so about the app - I won’t be surprised if it was an intentional honeypot, honestly, to expose those who will use it. And it’s a bad idea, there’s no way to verify anonymous accusations, which means it’s a tool for defamation of any man, and a way to discredit things of the kind written there at the same time.
These alleged high standards women hold are largely imaginary. It’s only kind of like that on dating apps, and that’s because they’re 80% male, so women HAVE to be picky.
Change the target to any other group and the outrage would be 100-10000 fold bigger.
Try it out, instead of Women rating men, try subbing in various minority groups or races.
Bonus points for the most offensive combinations…
e.g. Russians rating Ukrainians in your area…it can get pretty bad…I can think of many worse combos.
I’m sorry but I’ll just say it out right: new feminists are the absolute worst
Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for equality where possible. Where isn’t equality possible? Well I’d like to conceive a child, but the plumbing isn’t exactly useful for that. That sort of thing. Beyond that, were all the same, and IDGAF about your skin color, sexual preferences or whatever. I live by live and Let live, don’t be an asshole, it’s not that hard to be respectful
New feminists though are the ones coming up with ideas like this website. On the surface, anyone could say that it’s not a bad thing to have a place for women to talk about how to protect themselves. In reality though, it’s a place where men, innocent or not, get doxxed and made to be rapists.
There are some subs here on Lemmy as well that were very sad to see this shitshow of a website go, lamenting the fact that now they need a different place to dex people. Try not to tell them that doxxing is bad, it gets you banned.
I think the key reason this was seen as not being terribly offensive was the fact that women are disproportionately more likely than men to be on the receiving end of tons of different negative consequences when dating, thus to a degree justifying them having more of a safe space where their comfort and safety is prioritized.
However I think a lot of people are also recognizing now that such an app has lots of downsides that come as a result of that kind of structure, like false allegations being given too much legitimacy, high amounts of sensitive data storage, negative interactions being blown out of proportion, etc. I also think that this is yet another signature case of “private market solution to systemic problem” that only kind of addresses the symptoms, but not the actual causes of these issues that are rooted more in our societal standards and expectations of the genders, upbringing, depictions in media, etc.
I’m always reminded of the fact that women on dating sites rate 80% of the men as below average….
And the dating advisors who have written numerous articles about how women don’t really know or aren’t really honest with themselves about what they are looking for in a partner….
That was ONE OKCupid survey from years ago, and it also showed that women were more likely than men to message people they didn’t rate as attractive.
In reality, women and men rate male facial attractiveness about the same. https://datepsychology.com/can-women-identify-an-average-face/
I was making the point, that despite the fact that this is mildly ok. The test for anything that gives one group power over another, is to switch the groups.
If it’s still reasonable, than it is probably OK to keep it. If however it seems wrong after the switch, the bar to keep the power imbalance should be very high.
That’s a very superficial test that deliberately omits the social and historical context that makes sense of these categories. You can’t just insert one party for another in statements about a relationship where one side has more power and privilege than the other, and look at your feelings about the result to evaluate the statements. White people have historically mistreated everyone else and robbed them of freedom and power. Men have historically abused women. To say “let’s swap the words and see how we feel then” is not a reasonable way of evaluating statements about the relationships between these groups.
What this article says about the importance of entrenched power structures in racism also holds true about the relations between men and women:
https://www.aclrc.com/issues/anti-racism/cared/the-basics-level-1/myth-of-reverse-racism/
You can, and do.
It helps set the bar, it is a tool for determining how to assess what level of imbalance is reasonable.
It’s not the only tool, nor an I arguing for it to be.
Stats depend on perception. Where a woman reports abuse, a man often spends an evening drinking or something similar. Not reporting abuse.
Expectations of men are too somewhat cruel. You should be grenadier-tall (or gorilla-wide, point being, you should look fit), with facial features like those of Kianu Reeves, with voice like that of Orlando Bloom, confident like some CEO, honorable like a samurai from some movie, yet able to override that honor at her whim and do any atrocity to make the world better for her. Like some picture of 1930s’ propaganda.
If you don’t deliver, then she silently pities herself and silently looks down at you for that. But God forbid you seem like that picture in some regard and then inevitably turn out to be more human, that deceit she won’t forgive.
It was a problem a century ago that women were mostly right-wing and chauvinist and traditionalist. Most of that has been undone, but not how women in average see gender relations.
OK, so about the app - I won’t be surprised if it was an intentional honeypot, honestly, to expose those who will use it. And it’s a bad idea, there’s no way to verify anonymous accusations, which means it’s a tool for defamation of any man, and a way to discredit things of the kind written there at the same time.
These alleged high standards women hold are largely imaginary. It’s only kind of like that on dating apps, and that’s because they’re 80% male, so women HAVE to be picky.
I agree. High standards and common ideas of “right” are generally present among people insecure and easily gaslighted.
Such as those that would use this app. Point?
Might want to read up on the origins of Facebook before turning this into a gender wars thing.
Nothing about gender wars here.
Just because Facebook is shit, doesn’t make this any better.
Interesting analogy. You realize you have it backwards, right? Women are the Ukrainians on this scenario.
Agreed, but it is worse the way I put it…